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1:38 pm
September 19, 2014
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Noah Fence said
Working backwards.
What is the sane Middle Ground between the KKK are calling this a victory for white supremacy and wanting to prevent racist violence?
You're definitely wrong. There's no narrative that I'm trying to argue. I'm trying to find a real actionable solution. I have been an activist for about 20 years and I have never in my life felt more hopeless and lost.
A transwoman I know killed herself because of trumps promise to stop her from having access to medication she needs.
An activities I have known and have looked up to has decided it is best to move out of the country. They are a queer black Muslim (documented) immigrant who have been receiving hate mail for months from trump supporters.
A man told my cousins daughter that she was going to be deported yesterday. A grown was man told a 9 year old girl that her parents are illegal and that trump has promised to get rid of them. A stranger.
How do we stop this? I'm out of answers. I figured maybe you guys might have some insight.
Guess I'm wrong.
His anti establishment status is indifferent to me. I just know it's important to some of his supporters. He abandoned it as soon as he could though which is rather telling.
I didn't really say that trump was why, just that there was a spike on the day after. It's alarming. I have been busy volunteering with suicide hotlines for queer youth because people are afraid, deathly afraid, of the promises trump has made and the people on his team.
His vp thinks you can electrocute gay people to make them straight. He attempted to make it illegal for same sex couples to file marriage licenses. Crimes against lgbt people are also spiking. A friend of a friend had die he she written all over her car in the middle of the night.
The southern poverty law center claims that racially motivated attacks have tripled since trump was elected.
I'm exhausted with protesting. It doesn't work. We have been protesting for decades and nothing changes. We take two steps forwards and three back every single day.
And, lastly, just to be clear I don't care that they march. I care that while I'm sitting here calling trump racist you guys are saying he isn't. The KKK are calling him racist and you guys are silent. I don't care that they march but how do we tell them that his election isn't permission to engage in more racial division?
I'll respond more to other people later.
I haven't got the spoons. I'm exhausted and despaired. I'm grieving. I've lost too many people in my life and I don't know how to move forward.
Allow me to give you some perspective then. The KKK have been endorsing politicians for a long time. It's nothing new and there's really not much anyone can do about it. They choose to endorse a lot of shit, man. It's the same thing with the Westboro fucks. It's an ideology reaching an end so it's thrashing and jumping onto anything to keep itself alive.
The sane middle ground is hoping/urging Trump to do well as president. I don't like Obama as president but he has definitely got some things right. See how rational that sounds? That's the middle ground. Shed light on anything good he does and yell when he does something wrong because the reality is, he's going to do both. Don't continue to let the media fool you into thinking otherwise. It's clearly fucking you and a lot of other people up.
Like it or not, he IS going to be the president. No amount of protesting is going to change that. So, we move forward and get involved with local politics and actually pay attention to what our leaders do (which has been a long time coming anyway). If this election has taught us anything it's that people spinning stories and information only results in confusion and chaos when we are forced to face reality. So, maybe we should stop doing that?
You're asking for answers and people (well...some) are giving them to you, it's just not the ones you want, man. Be sane about the situation and help others form a more rational perspective. When people are legitimately depressed and have the potential for self-harm because Trump is going to be their president, point out some good things he's said he's going to do (he's said that of course the LGBTQ+ community will be protected under his presidency. Because they're Americans too. And he said it at a Republican rally. And people cheered. That's a fuckin win, Rob). Shit, even if he hasn't said a single thing that helps, point out local governments that these people can get involved with. People that stayed on the sidelines and let it happen should now be motivated to get out and do something. Right now it's taking the form of protests but keep those people interested and they could easily become mayors, governors, representatives, or president. All you have to do is motivate and Trump should have made that easy for you.
I've been called a bigot by you three times now, Rob. Shit, one time you called out the whole goddamned forum and basically slapped the "bigot" label on it. The same group of people that you told others to avoid were more than cool to you at the Gathering though. Shit, you even came back to that forum and are active again. Despite our differences and the fact that you've made it very clear that you think I'm a bigot, here I fuckin am writing a novel trying to convince you that things will be okay. Maybe ask yourself why, man. Why is it you can continuously label and name call others but they keep trying? The point I'm trying to make is maybe, juuuuuust maybe, you've been a little too quick to label and dismiss others as "racist" or "bigot" or even "nazi". Including Trump. I'm sure he has some bigoted views but--if you're willing to be honest with yourself--so does everyone else. No matter how subtle they are, they're there. That doesn't make him racist. It means he has some shit he needs to work on. Again, like everyone else.
Along the same lines, I once heard a story about this little boy who kept crying wolf. I don't remember how it ended but it's a decent story and I recommend you read it.
^shortened for everyone's sake^
1:52 pm
March 10, 2016
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King Lucem Ferre said
Says the generation that blames everything on my generation....
Wait how old are you? I blame everything on the hippies. I doubt you are 50 years or older.
1:55 pm
May 4, 2014
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Noah Fence said
I'm sorry that I sounded disingenuous. I'm real though. Since you aren't racist I would like to know how we as a country can stop the racially motivated violence that has come out ever since trump won.
Your answer is do nothing?
I can't.
And personally I don't care if you voted for Clinton or not. Nyro said in this thread that he voted for Johnson. That's far far far better than voting for trump. I'm more concerned with people who didn't participate at all, voted for harambe, or worse: voted for trump. I don't even like Hillary. In another thread I pointed out that she is racist too, just not as overtly as Trump.
I really just want solutions.
The kkk believe that trump ran a platform of racism. How can we fix that? What can we do, as people who hate bigotry, to bring about a better, more equal tomorrow if the KKK think that trump is on their side?
I don't think he is a scapegoat. I think he has made very clear promises and people are reacting. If you honestly believe he wasn't being racist, then how do we tell racist people that these promises aren't permission for them to let their hatred out?
I'll "give him a chance" when he makes a good faith effort to not promote his hostility driven racism.
His first chance is the transition team which includes unqualified members of his family, openly racist folks, and lobbyists.
Strike one.
His team is attempting to implement his promise of gutting religious freedom by registering religious minorities (Muslims).
Strike two.
CellE2057 said
Noah Fence said
A lot of you say that you aren't racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, or anything else for voting for Trump / not voting to stop him. Assuming that we give you the benefit of the doubt, my question is what do we do about this:
- The KKK are planning a march in North Carolina. Their website says "TRUMPS RACE UNITED MY PEOPLE". http://www.latimes.com/nation/.....story.html
Well I didn't vote for him but I didn't vote to stop him either so I guess this goes to me too? After all, tribalism is only bad if you're not interested in the tribe, aye, Rob?
We don't do anything about them marching. Same thing we should be doing about people protesting Trump. They wanna march, let em march so long as they remain peaceful.
- Donald Trump has named Stephen Bannon a noted propagandist as a chief strategist and policy advisor. Stphen Bannon is a self declared white supremacist and is vocally antisemitic.
Protest as much as you can and watch him like a fuckin hawk. Which we should be doing with any and all government officials but doubly so with this asshole.
- Reports of racial violence and graffiti are skyrocketing.
Despite the pics you posted and a few articles that have a single example, I can't seem to find one credible report backing this claim. Not saying it isn't true but I am saying that your sources aren't good. You can find a handful of cases where it's happening but you can also find a handful of people being violently attacked/harassed for being supposed Trump supporters as well. Single instances don't equal "skyrocketing".
- The average number of suicides per day is about 113. The day after Trump was announced our new president elect, the number went to nearly 400.
Anything I can find on this is saying that suicide rates before Trump got elected were really high this year so it's rather dishonest to say that it was very high post-Trump. It's true but it's dishonest. An increased number of suicides isn't something to ignore but it seems like you should know that saying "this thing is why" isn't how it works. Even if it was, the number is significantly higher for white males than any other group. So if you must go with the correlation thing, what we would do is try to make sure white males are okay and that they can talk to someone if they need to.
- For all of his anti-establishment rhetoric, one of trumps first appointees is: Reince Priebus a Washington insider.
Uh, I don't give a shit if he's anti-establishment and never claimed to. But again, this is apparently something that you think I should care about so uh...good or bad or whatever you want me to say here.
It really seems like you have a narrative all laid out and you're finding the evidence to make that narrative work, Rob. Maybe I'm wrong. Believe it or not, I sincerely want to be wrong here. I don't want to defend Trump. The dude is a total piece of incompetent shit BUT you can't blame him for all the problems in the world. Give it time and our president WILL do something that you can rightfully blame him for. There's no need to reach. It makes your tribe seem desperate and unreasonable. Bitch of it is, I don't want to be in the other tribe but it seems like you're trying your damnedest to put me there.
Almost like there's a sane middle ground that everyone screaming at each other is forgetting about...
Working backwards.
What is the sane Middle Ground between the KKK are calling this a victory for white supremacy and wanting to prevent racist violence?
You're definitely wrong. There's no narrative that I'm trying to argue. I'm trying to find a real actionable solution. I have been an activist for about 20 years and I have never in my life felt more hopeless and lost.
A transwoman I know killed herself because of trumps promise to stop her from having access to medication she needs.
An activities I have known and have looked up to has decided it is best to move out of the country. They are a queer black Muslim (documented) immigrant who have been receiving hate mail for months from trump supporters.
A man told my cousins daughter that she was going to be deported yesterday. A grown was man told a 9 year old girl that her parents are illegal and that trump has promised to get rid of them. A stranger.
How do we stop this? I'm out of answers. I figured maybe you guys might have some insight.
Guess I'm wrong.
His anti establishment status is indifferent to me. I just know it's important to some of his supporters. He abandoned it as soon as he could though which is rather telling.
I didn't really say that trump was why, just that there was a spike on the day after. It's alarming. I have been busy volunteering with suicide hotlines for queer youth because people are afraid, deathly afraid, of the promises trump has made and the people on his team.
His vp thinks you can electrocute gay people to make them straight. He attempted to make it illegal for same sex couples to file marriage licenses. Crimes against lgbt people are also spiking. A friend of a friend had die he she written all over her car in the middle of the night.
The southern poverty law center claims that racially motivated attacks have tripled since trump was elected.
I'm exhausted with protesting. It doesn't work. We have been protesting for decades and nothing changes. We take two steps forwards and three back every single day.
And, lastly, just to be clear I don't care that they march. I care that while I'm sitting here calling trump racist you guys are saying he isn't. The KKK are calling him racist and you guys are silent. I don't care that they march but how do we tell them that his election isn't permission to engage in more racial division?
I'll respond more to other people later.
I haven't got the spoons. I'm exhausted and despaired. I'm grieving. I've lost too many people in my life and I don't know how to move forward.
Some psychologists view the stages of grief as "denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance." If you're stuck in depression maybe change your patterns, perhaps by not treating DXM as a food group. Or not. Your body, your rules. I find the priorities of the Southern Poverty Law Center questionable, since they spend their time calling this cartoon a racist
rather than considering the likely sources of U.S. racial tension (bad policing, crappy schools, the war on drugs, etc.) For them it's gotta be cartoon frogs.
Whoop Whoop krunk :
CellE2057 |
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3:03 pm
Moderators
February 15, 2014
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@noah-fence
Trump himself is very pro LGBTQ+ . I do not know where people get the idea that he is not. ... Never mind, I do. It's from the same main stream media that lied through the entire campaign and the same people that were lied to are still following them. They are believing everything that the media says about Bannon. If you dig deeper into him (outside of the media), you will see that he is very pro LGBTQ+. He is pro racial equality. BUT he runs Breitbart (or did) which is a huge free speech advocate site and the things that they are attributing to him were not him but Breitbart submissions from other people. Most of the headlines they attribute to Bannon are really from Milo Yiannopoulos (A professional provocateur, who happens to be gay). Milo will tell you boldly that he is Islamophobic because any religion that dictates death sentences for gays is a religion he fears due to his homosexuality.
Back to Trump:
Here is a quote from his statement to the LBGTQ citizens: "I will do everything in my power to protect our LGBTQ citizens from the violence and oppression of a hateful foreign ideology."
Charles Moran, a gay Trump delegate from California, “We see a consistent line from Donald Trump that being pro LGBT and pro inclusion is a good business decision and I believe he’s going to bring that with him in the White House."
Trump became the first GOP presidential nominee to positively refer to the gay community in a convention acceptance speech. When the comment drew applause from the audience, Trump then ad-libbed -- “And I have to say, as a Republican, it is so nice to hear you cheering for what I just said. Thank you.”
Trump asked gay Silicon Valley tycoon Peter Thiel to address the Republican delegates. Thiel accepted then and is now a part of Trump’s transition team. And now Trump is said to be considering Richard Grenell, an openly gay man, to be his ambassador to the U.N.
From the Advocate interview:
Q: Would we see gay people in a Trump administration?
A: I would want the best and brightest. Sexual orientation would be meaningless. If the best person for the job happens to be gay, I would certainly appoint them.
Q: What would you do to combat antigay prejudice?
A: I like the idea of amending the 1964 Civil Rights Act to include a ban of discrimination based on sexual orientation. It would be simple. It would be straightforward. We don’t need to rewrite the laws currently on the books, although I do think we need to address hate-crimes legislation. But amending the Civil Rights Act would grant the same protection to gay people that we give to other Americans — it’s only fair.
Trump is not an enemy to the LGBT community. So where does the great LGBT threat reside? That would be with a LGBT Left that must keep the gay community in a perpetual state of culture war. The Republican LGBTs like to use this running joke: It's so much easier to be gay in the Republican Party than it is to be a Republican in the LGBT community. That just shows you where the tolerance really is.
On the topic of racism with Trump: Trump is a nationalist. Do not confuse the two. His comments about Mexicans is not about race. Mexican is not a race but a nationality. His anti-globalist stance is not about race either. It is about America. And yes, racists will always rally around nationalism as most racists are nationalists but all nationalists are not racist. Especially when it comes to the various forms of nationalism. Patriotic nationalism, economic nationalism, and defense nationalism have nothing to do with race.
I have said it before, Trump has decided he does not want a bunch of people in is cabinet that will agree with him. His strength will be that his advisors will have many different opinions (while leaning conservative) to give him a betting feel of the various stances people across the country have.
The media and the Democratic party is going to point to racism every chance they can. It has been revealed in the Podesta emails that their tactic this election was to make the media spin anything the Republicans do as being racist. They have not stopped. The complete control of the media was pointed out with links to the actual emails showing the collusion in a previous post on this topic. The only major news outlet that was shown not to be directly collaborating with the Clinton campaign was Fox news. Too bad they have such a bad reputation.
6:04 pm
October 30, 2013
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From 1993
"Your lack of online social presence makes it difficult for me to predict your needs..." - 2064: Read Only Memories
12:47 am
December 3, 2012
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Maybe this focus on the culture war in our country is a way to keep us busy squabbling over retarded shitwhen at the end of the day most of us want pretty much the same things at the core.
There's a gateway in our minds
That leads somewhere out there, far beyond this plane
Where reptile aliens made of light
Cut you open and pull out all your pain
Sturgill Simpson- Turtles All The Way Down
1:24 am
September 19, 2014
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Psyral Infection said
The media and the Democratic party is going to point to racism every chance they can. It has been revealed in the Podesta emails that their tactic this election was to make the media spin anything the Republicans do as being racist. They have not stopped. The complete control of the media was pointed out with links to the actual emails showing the collusion in a previous post on this topic. The only major news outlet that was shown not to be directly collaborating with the Clinton campaign was Fox news. Too bad they have such a bad reputation.
That bothers me a lot. I know people that rightfully mocked Fox News when Bush was in office for being so bias. The same people question my motives when I do it to MSNBC for their bias towards Obama/Clinton. The line between right and wrong only gets complicated when mother fuckers are about to do wrong.
1:28 am
September 18, 2012
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Slumerican502 said
Maybe this focus on the culture war in our country is a way to keep us busy squabbling over retarded shitwhen at the end of the day most of us want pretty much the same things at the core.
Bernie Sanders. Errr I mean, Kanye West.
Personally, I've never heard anything antigay from Trump before.
But you can't deny that he did empower the racists. He did it knowingly to use their votes. I can prove it. Almost.
Now, I'm not going to blame racism on Trump and I personally haven't seen an increase in hate crimes around me since the election, but, I mean, he did want that white power backing him. This divide is partially on his hands just as it's on Hillary's. How anybody can support either or bend over backwards defending either is beyond me.
Also, I made it clear why I didn't participate. I feel like America's downfall is poetic justice brought on by it's own stupidity. I don't think this will be our downfall, but this will be the beginning of that darkness in racial/cultural tension before things get better. What ever happens isn't blamed on one side. What happens is blamed on the country as a whole. It's our stupidity that brings what lies ahead. Not my stupidity though, I'm above normal Americans. I'm American supreme where we wave our flags in flames.
12:47 pm
Moderators
February 15, 2014
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#ElectionNight
.@GeorgeTakei
NY & CA don't represent America as a whole.
Wall St, media, & Hwood have disproportional influence as it is. pic.twitter.com/IrjTggYiol— Philip Schuyler (@FiveRights) November 20, 2016
1:18 pm
September 18, 2012
Offline
According to many people the Electoral college was extremely disproportionate to the popular vote.
Annoying Hillary Fiddle said
Trump wins the 3 states by 0.47% of the popular vote yet walks away with 86.7% of the electoral votes.
Thus proving that the electoral college isn't really used to give a fair balance to less populated areas like it's supposed to. It's used by who ever is in power to put their people on.
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Trump putting a lot of Wall St. people into the white house? That will be another regretful 'I told you so' under my belt from this election.
Steven Mnuchin is the guy he's trying to set as Treasury Secretary.
Whoop Whoop King Lucem Ferre :
ScottieD
11:44 am
March 10, 2016
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Lol, Lucem come on man 48 states have winner takes all laws for the electoral college. Hillary knew this and if she didn't she has no right running the country by not knowing the basic fundamentals of the majority of states voting system. As a matter of fact the only states to split votes usually are Maine and Nebraska but nebraska plans to accept a winner takes all law too.
Now you wouldn't be suggesting we break the law in those states for Hillary would you? I mean it wouldn't surprise me since you hate farmers and are obviously pro rioting and violence,but come on man how many more children have to have their throats ripped out by police dogs in order for you to be satisfied?
Whoop Whoop Nyro :
King Lucem Ferre11:22 pm
October 30, 2013
Offline
Didn't know where best to post this...
Just in case there was still anyone out there that felt bad for Tila Tiquila, here ya go.
http://thecelebrityauction.co/.....zi-salute/
Also, there are events like this going on all around the country now.
Raise your hand if you're sure you support Trump!
and
"Seek Help! Seek Help! Seek Help!"
"Your lack of online social presence makes it difficult for me to predict your needs..." - 2064: Read Only Memories
1:00 am
September 18, 2012
Offline
Nyro said
Lol, Lucem come on man 48 states have winner takes all laws for the electoral college. Hillary knew this and if she didn't she has no right running the country by not knowing the basic fundamentals of the majority of states voting system. As a matter of fact the only states to split votes usually are Maine and Nebraska but nebraska plans to accept a winner takes all law too.
And what does that have to do with my point? And what does any of this have to do with Hillary? Ain't nobody like that cunt.
Now you wouldn't be suggesting we break the law in those states for Hillary would you? I mean it wouldn't surprise me since you hate farmers and are obviously pro rioting and violence,but come on man how many more children have to have their throats ripped out by police dogs in order for you to be satisfied?
My Grand daddy is a farmer. Was a farmer. He's too old now. My Grand daddy was a badass. He also used to beat the living shit out of my mom. I look up to that man. He's so old now, that he has troubles running his green houses where he grows flowers now though.
4:32 am
Moderators
February 15, 2014
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Cheshyr said
Didn't know where best to post this...Just in case there was still anyone out there that felt bad for Tila Tiquila, here ya go.
http://thecelebrityauction.co/.....zi-salute/
Also, there are events like this going on all around the country now.
Raise your hand if you're sure you support Trump!
and
"Seek Help! Seek Help! Seek Help!"
@cheshyr Yep, she's an idiot. As is anyone who supports Racial Supremacy.
While Racial Supremacists may like Trump, He has disavowed their support on multiple occasions. There were racists that liked Hillary too. That didn't make me think she was more or less racist than she was.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/.....story.html
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballo.....premacists
http://www.washingtontimes.com.....supremacy/
The Nazi party is dying and will be irrelevant soon. They are looking for any publicity they can. They invited the media to their meeting specifically to get the attention they want.
I am an active participant in the Republican and even the "alt-right" circles to some degree, and there is not one person in those groups that I participate in that believes in any Racial Supremacy. It is considered incredibly stupid. That doesn't mean that racists won't support the same thing that right-wings do, but many right-wingers do not support racists and actively denounce them.
You should have seen how quickly Nazi supporters were shut down at Trump rallies by Trump supporters. What is interesting is that the media followed them around and waited to start filming till they started shouting Nazi chants. Several of the people were shown to be really Hillary supporters. YouTube has video of the same people captured in Pro-Hillary Rallies, Anti-Trump Rallies, and regular Trump Rallies. The difference was when they were in Trump rallies they pretended to be Nazis for the camera.
4:33 am
October 30, 2013
Offline
Seriously though... this is clever and well-done as FUCK!
If you love The Floyd...
Check it out before the YouTube COPyright squad takes in down.
Whoop Whoop Cheshyr :
Psyral"Your lack of online social presence makes it difficult for me to predict your needs..." - 2064: Read Only Memories
5:28 am
April 4, 2012
Offline
Cheshyr said
Didn't know where best to post this...Just in case there was still anyone out there that felt bad for Tila Tiquila, here ya go.
http://thecelebrityauction.co/.....zi-salute/
Lol wtf? ... I'd still hit it...
6:02 am
Moderators
February 15, 2014
Offline
King Lucem Ferre said
Psyral Infection said
Some shit about Kanye supporting Trump.
We all have flaws, Psyral.
Wow.
6:53 am
October 30, 2013
Offline
@psyral-infection
Ain't it soooooooooo "funny" how music made twenty years ago seems WAY too "topical" THESE days...?!?
20years ago from the time THAT song was made, people were listening to:
Oh fuck. The Matrix done gone glitched...
"Your lack of online social presence makes it difficult for me to predict your needs..." - 2064: Read Only Memories
7:36 am
Moderators
February 15, 2014
Offline
@cheshyr , Not so much funny (to me) but the sign of good artistic music. Stands the test of time and speaks to people generations after it was written. Whether someone agrees with the sentiment or not, it does show a continuity of thought and expression of people throughout time.
Good finds!
8:44 am
March 10, 2016
Offline
Honestly Lucem it seems relevant to me. Maybe we should get rid of the popular vote all together and give each state 1 point. If a states people vote majority for someone that candidate gets the point. That way it is simplistic, gives every state equal power and makes them feel every vote matters.
Makes sense to me and I honestly have nothing to complain about, Texas has the second highest amount of electoral votes currently being california.
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