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The Supreme Court has Legalized Gay Marriage on a National Level
June 29, 2015
10:23 pm
Pigg
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As I said before, context is key. Let's be real here, me NOT calling my friends "faggots" jokingly isn't going to stop an ACTUAL homophobic person from using it perjoratively towards homo/bi/transsexuals. If someone gets offended by what I am saying in JEST to my FRIEND, you don't think they're overreacting a little bit? When people are pissed off at each other, after they reach a certain point, they will say whatever they can to be as hurtful as possible if they don't know better. I know better. If I am having a disagreement or an argument, calling the other party a faggot isn't going to help in any way. I never use it in that context.

 

It's kind of like the whole "teach rapists not to rape" thing. No one DESERVES to be raped, and we should never blame a victim, but saying that we should teach men not to rape instead of teaching women to defend themselves is ludicrous. Men are told from a very early age by society and everything else that rape is one of the WORST things you can do to another human being. Everyone knows that it is very illegal. Do you think rapists care? Obviously not, since people are still getting raped. 

June 29, 2015
10:58 pm
Novocaine, The Blue Collar King
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King Lucem Ferre said

Novocaine, That Aussie Asshole said

King Lucem Ferre said

Novocaine, That Aussie Asshole said

King Lucem Ferre said

Novocaine, That Aussie Asshole said

King Lucem Ferre said
This argument again? You're all bigots.

i probably am.

but your a bigot for calling me a bigot. bigot.

You're a bigot for calling me a bigot for calling you a bigot. Bigot.

your a bigger bigot for being a bigot that calls other bigots bigot. Bigot.

You're an even bigger bigot for being a bigot that calls bigots that call bigots bigots bigots. Big idiot.

you're a big idiot bigot, calling bigots who cal bigots big idiot bigots  and bigots big idiots and big idiots bigots. big idiot bigot.

Go fuck yourself.

WINNING!

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June 30, 2015
2:12 am
bayAreaShaman
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I think Tidwell was in the right. And krunks intentions were in the wrong place. I don't krunk was arguing free speech she was arguing herself. If ur holding up the word nigger in the name if free speech count me out ur march. Choose ur arguments my friends. A good vocabulary and good debat skills and for some reason for a lot of u this fascination on words to derail arguments and fog peoples points is no Escuse for nothing.

i don't use the word retard for fun cuz i have a beautiful niece with Down syndrome and one day that word will make her cry. I see my friend Kenny's eyes fill with pain and fear when we heard the word nigger.

words don't hurt it's the fact people want to hurt me or don't care if they do that hurts. Much love people...

YOU KNOW THEY AINT NO SUCH THING AS LEFTOVER CRACK!!!- Leftover Crack

June 30, 2015
4:07 am
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Pigg said
As I said before, context is key. Let's be real here, me NOT calling my friends "faggots" jokingly isn't going to stop an ACTUAL homophobic person from using it perjoratively towards homo/bi/transsexuals. If someone gets offended by what I am saying in JEST to my FRIEND, you don't think they're overreacting a little bit? When people are pissed off at each other, after they reach a certain point, they will say whatever they can to be as hurtful as possible if they don't know better. I know better. If I am having a disagreement or an argument, calling the other party a faggot isn't going to help in any way. I never use it in that context.

 

It's kind of like the whole "teach rapists not to rape" thing. No one DESERVES to be raped, and we should never blame a victim, but saying that we should teach men not to rape instead of teaching women to defend themselves is ludicrous. Men are told from a very early age by society and everything else that rape is one of the WORST things you can do to another human being. Everyone knows that it is very illegal. Do you think rapists care? Obviously not, since people are still getting raped. 

I agree context matters, but sometimes you can't really control what the context is outside of a certain experience, so I don't mind being extra cautious. 

The thing about teaching men not to rape is that it's next to impossible to get a conviction for rape because we teach society to not value women. I don't have the statistics with me so I can't remember them exactly, but in the text we use in my sex ed class, reports say that somewhere around 90% of all rapes go unreported and the ones that do get reported face severe scrutiny. The victim is questioned with ridiculous questions like how many people she's slept with before and what she was wearing etc. to the point that convictions of rapists are almost nonexistence and if the victim talked to her rapist for as little as 15 minutes, they go down to less than 1% of a conviction rape. Basically, getting someone charged and convicted for rape is impossible.

We need consent education. period. What qualifies as consent, what doesn't, and why consent needs to be respected. We need to shift the blame from the victim to the assailant and one way to do that is with slogans like 'teach men not to rape'. The slogan isn't meant to be taken entirely literally but to talk about shifting the blame. Should women defend themselves? of course. that isn't what the slogan is saying. The slogan is saying that we teach women that its their fault when they're raped. 

When you say "the victims should have --" you're really saying they should have made sure the rapist had raped someone else. Rape and sexual assault are crimes of convenience and the only way to stamp them out is to address the myth that women who are sexually promiscuous are somehow leading men on simply by existing or by wearing the wrong clothing or whatever.

In my class, we spend entire sessions on what it means to consent, proper ways of asking for consent and proper ways of denying it, and we talk at length about the horrific abuses that face victims of rape in the judicial system and how to increase the odds of a person getting a conviction. it's important stuff.

Last year, a woman named Emma Sulkowicz (I hope i spelled that right, I didn't double check) was raped by a friend of hers. Someone she had had casual sex with before, apparently. When she attempted to have him punished, her school silenced her. The police did nothing as well because it was someone she had admitted to sleeping with on other occasions. this is entirely common. In colleges, 1 in 4 women are sexually assaulted while on campus and nothing happens. Emma was an art student and she decided to make her senior thesis a performance art piece and she began carrying her mattress around campus in order to create awareness of the lack of support she received from her school. She said she would carry it until she and her rapist were no longer attending school together and she ended up carrying it until she graduated. 

too often men rape women because they know they can get away with it.

(it should be noted that women can and do rape men and that male victims have similarly hard times getting convictions, how ever most men are raped by other men -something like 85% of male victims are assaulted by men- and men are raped significantly less frequently than women are).

 

June 30, 2015
6:28 am
Cheshyr
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RobTidwell said 

Last year, a woman named Emma Sulkowicz (I hope i spelled that right, I didn't double check) was raped by a friend of hers. Someone she had had casual sex with before, apparently. When she attempted to have him punished, her school silenced her. The police did nothing as well because it was someone she had admitted to sleeping with on other occasions. this is entirely common. In colleges, 1 in 4 women are sexually assaulted while on campus and nothing happens. Emma was an art student and she decided to make her senior thesis a performance art piece and she began carrying her mattress around campus in order to create awareness of the lack of support she received from her school. She said she would carry it until she and her rapist were no longer attending school together and she ended up carrying it until she graduated. 

Uh, yeah... about that; you may wanna do a little follow up on that one. Since the story came out, she's pretty much been revealed to be a vindictive "art project" nutjob. I referenced it here a while back. After her little "experience", she went a made a PORN video she wants us to consider "art" that turns into a supposed recreation of her "ordeal"... here:

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/.....erformance

 

And just on a side note, Rob; You're not gonna win any awards for all the social justice work you've been doing since you showed up in the forums. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm not saying I don't agree with you or that your heart is in the wrong place but...

It's getting stale.

Give up on trying to "educate" everyone on here every damned time there's an opportunity to go off on some tear about "these people's or that people's" rights or thoughts or whatever else it is that happens to come down the pike that you feel needs to be "defended". Ever since you logged on, other than your art project, the majority of what I end up seeing is long form prose about every social interest you seem to have and this compulsion to "correct" people while passive-aggressively dumping all kinds of political correctness into every conversation. You're turning into the Anita Sarkeesian of the forum.

There's plenty of intelligent and erudite Juggalos and Lettes around here capable of debating all these issues ad nauseam (as they become) but it is losing its luster. While Juggalo culture is learning more about its tolerances every day, I think we can all agree that it is unapologetically heterosexual in nature. Doesn't mean anyone else can't come along and enjoy what the scene has to offer but coming to complain [excuse me, "point things out"] about it is no better than Anita over there showing up at E3 and bitching about all the violence in DOOM and the ladies working the booths.

Hey, keep fightin' the good fight, make your voice of dissent heard when it needs to be but, like I said, there's no brass ring to be had around here and any improvements to the attitudes surrounding your pet issues will not be garnered in these pages or be reflective of your work in them. Pick your battles (and your platforms). Just reel it in a little bit. Your world will still turn if you don't respond to EVERY post you disagree with.

Sally forth, little soldier!

 

Oh and please edit when quoting quotes of quotes of quotes. There's no need to have five copies of every response that came before it attached to a post responding to one of them. It's a waste of page space.

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June 30, 2015
9:55 am
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bayAreaShaman said  
i don't use the word retard for fun cuz i have a beautiful niece with Down syndrome and one day that word will make her cry. I see my friend Kenny's eyes fill with pain and fear when we heard the word nigger.

words don't hurt it's the fact people want to hurt me or don't care if they do that hurts. Much love people...

We obviously value different things; I don't expect people to care, and when they actually do it's real and it's love. I've picked my battle, and pity's not it.

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June 30, 2015
10:26 am
bayAreaShaman
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krunkazphuk said

bayAreaShaman said  
i don't use the word retard for fun cuz i have a beautiful niece with Down syndrome and one day that word will make her cry. I see my friend Kenny's eyes fill with pain and fear when we heard the word nigger.

words don't hurt it's the fact people want to hurt me or don't care if they do that hurts. Much love people...

We obviously value different things; I don't expect people to care, and when they actually do it's real and it's love. I've picked my battle, and pity's not it.

It's not obvious to me. Care about what? And I hope u don't some up the other sides arguments and points as just Pity. Did u read that part u quoted and say oh yeah we got different values. That up there's all love homie not pity. But again it's not obvious to what was said but I kinda wanna leave it alone cuz I don't feel like changing u and ur smart and if u can't see what we see that's fine. I don't wanna use those words for the same reason I open doors for women and give my seat up for old people it's just decent.

YOU KNOW THEY AINT NO SUCH THING AS LEFTOVER CRACK!!!- Leftover Crack

June 30, 2015
10:51 am
Novocaine, The Blue Collar King
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Cheshyr said 

And just on a side note, Rob; You're not gonna win any awards for all the social justice work you've been doing since you showed up in the forums. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm not saying I don't agree with you or that your heart is in the wrong place but...

It's getting stale.

Give up on trying to "educate" everyone on here every damned time there's an opportunity to go off on some tear about "these people's or that people's" rights or thoughts or whatever else it is that happens to come down the pike that you feel needs to be "defended". Ever since you logged on, other than your art project, the majority of what I end up seeing is long form prose about every social interest you seem to have and this compulsion to "correct" people while passive-aggressively dumping all kinds of political correctness into every conversation. You're turning into the Anita Sarkeesian of the forum.

this is kinda how i feel about this at this stage. we get it, your a caped avenger for the LGBT community. i suppose i could just not read it, but i get bored.

I think youve made your stance very clear, some people agree, some people dont and some people find the whole business just fucking confusing. I tried learning, but whose to say in 12 months transwoman/man isnt offensive? too much effort for an oversensitive bunch of nonsense if you ask me.

 

as for the whole rape mattress schtick. dude, the chick clearly is an attention grabbing whore. i watched a few of her videos (including the porn one, which trying to say it might be an reenactment of rape is just laughable) and it just comes across like shes trying to grab attention by bringing some poor dude down. 

June 30, 2015
11:11 am
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bayAreaShaman said

krunkazphuk said 

We obviously value different things; I don't expect people to care, and when they actually do it's real and it's love. I've picked my battle, and pity's not it.

It's not obvious to me. Care about what? And I hope u don't some up the other sides arguments and points as just Pity. Did u read that part u quoted and say oh yeah we got different values. That up there's all love homie not pity. But again it's not obvious to what was said but I kinda wanna leave it alone cuz I don't feel like changing u and ur smart and if u can't see what we see that's fine. I don't wanna use those words for the same reason I open doors for women and give my seat up for old people it's just decent.

I don't expect anyone to care about anything. I just know what I care about. Assuming someone doesn't see what you see because they don't share your values seems shortsighted. I prefer genuine action, and most activism I've seen firsthand has seemed self-indulgent rather than effective. Rob gets personal about other people then draws his own lines about psychological triggers and comments about his admittedly unhealthy weight. Love is the best idea, maybe the only idea, and before anyone attacks the world to fix it it may be in their best interest to first check themselves and learn to love themselves. I'm raising a daughter and realize my actions are teaching way more than my words. For me real caring involves an exchange, not talking at people and waiting for someone to agree with you. That's just verbal masturbation.

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June 30, 2015
11:49 am
Pigg
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I don't know, folks, I think we're being unfair here. Rob has the right to bring up and question whatever he wants. Just as I, or any of you do. Just because WE don't agree with it doesn't mean he shouldn't bring it up. I think these are good conversations to have. A hell of a lot more important than some of the other trivial drivel we bullshit about.

 

As far as words, my dad raised me NEVER to say "nigger" or "retard," and I don't. But does that mean I should try and control what other people say? ESPECIALLY, when they are not using it as an insult. People say stupid shit to their friends all the time, that doesn't mean they are hateful people. Someone who ACTUALLY uses those words in a disparaging way deserve to get their ass best, but as I've reiterated, CONTEXT.

 

Also, some videos:

http://youtu.be/NXWBvB4U-cA

 

Yeah, and I'm sure someone will mention that they're all white people, but I don't see why they matters.

June 30, 2015
12:07 pm
Novocaine, The Blue Collar King
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i agree that it can be entertaining for a time. but at some point dont you feel like (and im going to use rob here, but he is not the only guilty party by far) your having your brains bashed in by a PC bat?

i mean, in some of the posts in here, they could be summed up with "OI FUCKHEAD! STOP BEING FUCKING OFFENSIVE" while some other guy is sitting at the other end of the room saying 'nigger, tranny, retard, whoreslut'. only in this threads case, its walls of text which amount to generally the same thing. The horse is dead man, stop poking it.

 

and i forgot how much i loved george carlin. dudes awesome.

June 30, 2015
12:17 pm
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Ay, I'm just sayin' don't go to Japan and complain about Asian drivers... don't go to gay pride rallies and complain that straight sensibilities aren't being represented... or go to horror movies and make a scene about all the blood... or petition stores to put condoms in the feminine hygiene sections... or go France and complain that nothing is in English... or go to a roller skating rink and complain about wheelchair access... or go to a Harley Davidson dealership and ask why they don't have Vespas...

Doesn't mean there isn't a conversation to be had but... ya know... odds are....

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June 30, 2015
12:17 pm
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Pigg said  
...Yeah, and I'm sure someone will mention that they're all white people, but I don't see why they matters.

It's funny that you call cartoon characters white people.

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June 30, 2015
12:17 pm
bayAreaShaman
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krunkazphuk said

bayAreaShaman said

krunkazphuk said 
We obviously value different things; I don't expect people to care, and when they actually do it's real and it's love. I've picked my battle, and pity's not it.

It's not obvious to me. Care about what? And I hope u don't some up the other sides arguments and points as just Pity. Did u read that part u quoted and say oh yeah we got different values. That up there's all love homie not pity. But again it's not obvious to what was said but I kinda wanna leave it alone cuz I don't feel like changing u and ur smart and if u can't see what we see that's fine. I don't wanna use those words for the same reason I open doors for women and give my seat up for old people it's just decent.

I don't expect anyone to care about anything. I just know what I care about. Assuming someone doesn't see what you see because they don't share your values seems shortsighted. I prefer genuine action, and most activism I've seen firsthand has seemed self-indulgent rather than effective. Rob gets personal about other people then draws his own lines about psychological triggers and comments about his admittedly unhealthy weight. Love is the best idea, maybe the only idea, and before anyone attacks the world to fix it it may be in their best interest to first check themselves and learn to love themselves. I'm raising a daughter and realize my actions are teaching way more than my words. For me real caring involves an exchange, not talking at people and waiting for someone to agree with you. That's just verbal masturbation.

I don't not assume people don't  see what I see because the have different  values... Like I said perspective is the folly of man. And that sucks that u feel most activism u seen is self indulgent.  Maybe ur in the wrong place.  I don't see how rob does anything different than anyone else on here but hey I'm new. Some people have triggers. A lot of folks burst out with they crazy. I know I do.  I don't think u should wait on some to agree With you also. Plus if u want to change someone's mind there's better ways than brainwashing  and repeating ur self. Maybe not as effective in some cases. I dunno u love words. I think they both matter. Like my dad leads thru example wich was awesome but I really wish I heard some things come out his mouth and I wish I didn't hear others. Both have affected me greatly. 

YOU KNOW THEY AINT NO SUCH THING AS LEFTOVER CRACK!!!- Leftover Crack

June 30, 2015
12:19 pm
Cheshyr
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Argh! Now I can't edit you quick draw muthafakos!

 

ps. the animated smilies we have available aren't showing...

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June 30, 2015
12:26 pm
Pigg
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krunkazphuk said

Pigg said  
...Yeah, and I'm sure someone will mention that they're all white people, but I don't see why they matters.

It's funny that you call cartoon characters white people.

Well Rick's last name is sanchez, so either he's Spanish (white) or something else (partially Latino) I meant specifically the ones that are referring to race.

June 30, 2015
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bayAreaShaman said 

I don't not assume people don't  see what I see because the have different  values... Like I said perspective is the folly of man. And that sucks that u feel most activism u seen is self indulgent.  Maybe ur in the wrong place.  I don't see how rob does anything different than anyone else on here but hey I'm new. Some people have triggers. A lot of folks burst out with they crazy. I know I do.  I don't think u should wait on some to agree With you also. Plus if u want to change someone's mind there's better ways than brainwashing  and repeating ur self. Maybe not as effective in some cases. I dunno u love words. I think they both matter. Like my dad leads thru example wich was awesome but I really wish I heard some things come out his mouth and I wish I didn't hear others. Both have affected me greatly. 

I'm not trying to change minds. I'll just grow mine. I do love words, just love actions more. Hope your bad memories fade.

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June 30, 2015
12:33 pm
bayAreaShaman
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Pigg said
I don't know, folks, I think we're being unfair here. Rob has the right to bring up and question whatever he wants. Just as I, or any of you do. Just because WE don't agree with it doesn't mean he shouldn't bring it up. I think these are good conversations to have. A hell of a lot more important than some of the other trivial drivel we bullshit about.

 

As far as words, my dad raised me NEVER to say "nigger" or "retard," and I don't. But does that mean I should try and control what other people say? ESPECIALLY, when they are not using it as an insult. People say stupid shit to their friends all the time, that doesn't mean they are hateful people. Someone who ACTUALLY uses those words in a disparaging way deserve to get their ass best, but as I've reiterated, CONTEXT.

 

Also, some videos:

http://youtu.be/NXWBvB4U-cA

 

Yeah, and I'm sure someone will mention that they're all white people, but I don't see why they matters.

I agree with u. But I had personal instances that my joke just didn't sit right. Like what did u say that I had bouncing in my head it was somthing like it's not the intent it's the impact was that u? I guess if was I agree with u both  ways. rick and Morty got it.

YOU KNOW THEY AINT NO SUCH THING AS LEFTOVER CRACK!!!- Leftover Crack

June 30, 2015
1:03 pm
Pigg
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Yeah, impact is important, but if it offends someone you care about, apologize.

June 30, 2015
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krunkazphuk said

bayAreaShaman said 
I don't not assume people don't  see what I see because the have different  values... Like I said perspective is the folly of man. And that sucks that u feel most activism u seen is self indulgent.  Maybe ur in the wrong place.  I don't see how rob does anything different than anyone else on here but hey I'm new. Some people have triggers. A lot of folks burst out with they crazy. I know I do.  I don't think u should wait on some to agree With you also. Plus if u want to change someone's mind there's better ways than brainwashing  and repeating ur self. Maybe not as effective in some cases. I dunno u love words. I think they both matter. Like my dad leads thru example wich was awesome but I really wish I heard some things come out his mouth and I wish I didn't hear others. Both have affected me greatly. 

I'm not trying to change minds. I'll just grow mine. I do love words, just love actions more. Hope your bad memories fade.

Thanks homie

YOU KNOW THEY AINT NO SUCH THING AS LEFTOVER CRACK!!!- Leftover Crack

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